Would anybody be interested in knowing the relative scarcity of various army swords? I have my own impression as to the relative scarcity of various models, but would be interested to know how accurate those impressions really are. One way to do this would be to start a poll, listing the various army patterns by maker and having a place where members can indicate how many of each pattern they actually own. If we get enough member participation, over time, we can get a pretty good idea of the relative scarcity of the various army patterns. There would be some duplication as certain swords are transferred from one collector to another they might be counted twice, but that would not seriously affect the relative scarcity of each pattern. Joe S

Hi Joe-

I'd be interested. I've kept an eye on what, where, when, how much, and why of the Heer saber market.

What somewhat complicates the issue in my book is the numerous variations of the same pattern encountered on some examples. Variances include hilt base matierial, grip wire material, grip ferruels, etc. I suppose we could simply look at the examples as generically as possible ans ascertain whats what.

Either way i'd like to see the results. I've been attempting to amass 1 example of every generic pattern saber produced during the TR period. I'm also hoping to put together a free reference in digital format, similiar in nature to Angolia which lists the various patterns, their model number, and corresponging image.

Joe, i'd be more than happy to participate and lend a hand if needed.

Tom

Good topic. You might want to contact ACE
He`s suppose to be putting out a book on swords with a avalability scale.
I have a Voos Lionhead that there`s only 3 known. I`ll post a pic of it tomorrow.
Here`s a couple teaser pics.

Lots of groovy ones here.

Another.

Mr.Fab,
I think you need to expand your room size to make room for your stuff or get a good friend to hang the silver lion head on their wall wink wink...LOL
You are right it's a teaser picture.

Eric

George-
Killer examples on those 1st 3. Nice.

Here's a few examples of some of the "junk" i've got "hanging" around. Some of it.

2

Just 2 of the many homeless examples yet to find a resting place.

Any Damascus Third Reich in the piles??

Here are a few real tough to find patterns.
The Wingen I`ve seen only 1(mine), the Voos I know of 2 others in the same collection, one being silver.It`s the same one in one of Johnsons book.Great color pic.

Here are 3 Alcoso products, all toughies to find and the dovehead is the only one I know of.
These are all standard production swords.

These Alcoso`s look alot like the Derflinger and Zieten by Eickhorn!!
Maybe that`s why we don`t see many of these models.

You will find more of these swords as they were production model swords. Grant it there is not many around....In my production sword model collecting days I owned a few I never saw before (or so I thought). I collect Damascus Imperial and Third Reich. A REAL Damascus Third Reich Damascus sword that is Rare!

Sadly, this is true. Lot more damscus daggers than swords.
Mostly they will be in the "Roon" style hilt.
Let`s see some pics of that puppy.

No damasc. in mine. Very tough. Had seen one which was a Roon recently that was the subject of some debate if I recall correctly.

This Puma example has been one of my favorites. Mixture of cast and hand scrolled hilt work. Brass base, etc. Note the ultra deep chizzle work on this girl. I havn't seen or come accross another one of these by Puma. I really just like this one alot.

George-
I can't recall ever coming accross that doveheaded ACS. All 3 sure are nice my friend.

Photo doesn't really show it, but this one has about 99% of her original gold colored gilt.

backstrap. See the deep, ornate acorns and leaves.

There's a Herder shown on pag 86 of Angolia, upper left corner. Dovehead with both the cast and hand worked embellishment like my Puma. I've been looking for years for one. Finally, a couple months back a fella was selling her and because of a variety of factors, I was unable to pony up the money for her. I know it's likely that Herder model won't be popping up anytime soon again. I should have ****ed it up and put it on my credit card. It was only $400!!!! . Family though comes first and that dictated where money had to go.

A complete C&J I really like. She in great condition, but not rare...however, it's another model I really like, combining the cast langet with handworked P-guard, backstrap, pommel, etc. This one has the plane, unembellished reverse langet. It looks like the type you'd see on some of the unadorn cavalry sabers or a simple NCO plain langet.

Again with original hanger.

I missed the Roon Post were or when was that?? Thanks

Do a search through the forearm archives from around 2 years ago. If memory serves me, it was a dovehead, Roon stylized langet, with a damas or etched blade. Can't say for certain but the saber became a focal point of some debate. You won't miss it in the archives as the thread had both many hits as well as significant replies. I'll do a search later tonight and post a link to it for everyones reading pleasure assumings it hasn't been removed or deleted.

George, you've got some really nice, rarer pieces in there. Some of the pieces seemingly never hit the markets. Well done.

Sword fish .... sent you a e-mail..

MY LUTZOW

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Jan Jan- Nice Lutzow. Tough model to track down. Still need one.

Damast- I replied in the PM.

Good collecting and good stuff my friends,
Tom

That`s a tough one to find in collectible shape. Congrats.

It would seem a number of the more rare patterns are those that officers did not like during the period. I admit (just my taste) some of those very rare patterns are just UGLY. Some, like the Lutzow, are just boring. Others seem to be from the smaller companies not as available for purchase compared to the larger makers who were probably everywhere.

I like that observation of the Lutzow as boring.Never did a thing for me.
bgrelics just sold a Herder Artillery with a UGLY Lionhead.
Beauty`s in the eye of the beholder!!