I'm aware that so called 'officer candidate' SS degens are found with etched blades, such as the ones on Craig's and Chip Gambino's sites, but are such blades to be found on the Honour degen which was of course an award and as such I thought would conform to a standard and not be available with optional extras.
Just that there is one on a dealers site, rune button on grip, correct scabbard fittings, but the blade is etched with the SS motto on the obverse and oak leaves on the reverse.
TJ sells these blades and describes themas 'probable post war produced'.

Anybody got comments?

You have reason to be cautious. Although there may be exceptions, I have never seen such a blade on an SS honor degen. Of course, the Himmler "birthday" degens are in a special category and do have inscriptions on their blades. The standard honor degen, as you point out, was awarded and, in my view, would not have had an inscribed or etched blade with the SS motto, etc. They should be of standard design, as issued. It would be possible for a recipient to replace the issue blade, but why? It sounds like the degen you describe may have more than one postwar part, which is likely what the blade is. It would help if you could post photos here. It doesn't pay to never say "never" in this hobby, but this one sounds very suspicious.

Sounds hookey!!
Can we ask whose site?
Seiler (Yank in UK)

I think that Grumpy zeroed in very nicely on the problems with the sword. TJ advises prospective purchasers right up front that he thinks the etched blades are postwar. And I’ve seen more than one of these “special edition” SS swords that started out life as German Police swords. So to look at it as anything but a parts sword might not be the best course of action. Unless it’s priced right and you are comfortable with the situation. FP

Mr Nolan,

I agree with Tom Johnson that these blades are probably postwar etched. I have seen them on both SS and Polizei swords and I would not own one. This etch started showing up around 1970 and some of the swords and blades have some age on them now. Of course that is around the same time that Paul Müller was active in his backyard forge once again. Johnson was visiting Müller and Solingen around this time and probably saw what was coming out of these sources. I would trust his opinion in this matter. Buyer beware!

Gents,
Thanks for the replies, I wasn't even thinking of purchsing it, just wanted expert opinions, all part of the learning curve on these things.

As to the site, I would rather not say on an open forum, don't wish to ruffle any feathers, but I will PM each of you that replied.

Thanks

Adrian

I would add there was an officer candidate sword on an auction site a month or two ago with this type blade. It had a questionable portepee attached and the sword itself appeared to be the "Dachau" or "Muller" type. The etching looks suspiciously similar to that on the K98 issue bayonets with postwar SS etchings. It was priced around $1500, so that should tell us something. I haven't looked up the one in question here yet, so may be speaking out of turn on it.

Ade,
we're on the same wave length and I know what you mean and see your point.
How is little Georgie? I bet she is getting to be a big baby girl by now.
You BETTER send me a picture of her Mister N.
Emmy is 5 now, where does the time go mate?

Grumpy,
That sounds exactly like the one I've seen, Dachau style i.e. no burnish in the scabbard fittings and also the button looks like stainless rather than nickle, also as you point out the etching is very like the post war ones, all this together is why I brought it up, wouldn't want to see a member burned, now priced at $13500.

Donnie, how are you mate, I 'will' get scanner one day, I will have to shortly as I'm now very much into family history and need to copy many old phto's that are coming my way, one of the boys 'gave' me his old one but I couldn't get it to work on the new computer, something to do with the softeware. They are dirt cheap to buy, just a case of getting round to it. Now retired there is less time to do too many things, any way Donnie, Georgie is fine and a little beauty, will break hearts when she grows up that one.
Regards

Adrian

Mr. Nolan,

Concerning your scanner that you are unable to down load to your present computer operating system.

Recently I installed the new XP operating system which rendered my scanner inoperable and the related driver disc at hand, was incompatible with my new system.

I found a firm that sells all drivers to include out dated drivers as needed for a very nominal fee of only $2.00 plus shipping. I ordered the corresponding driver that I needed and installed my scanner in an instant with no problems.

Since we're both retirees, I felt that I would spare you the brain damage and possibly prevent you the expense of buying a new scanner.

This is the web site address to purchase the drivers: http://driverguide.com

Good luck and best regards,

John

John,

Thank you very much for that info, very considerate and thoughtful of you do so. XP is what I'm running so I should be able to sort it via your link, once again thanks.

Regards

Adrian

Donnie, I sent you PM

Ade

Why are we still using the incorrect term of candidate SS Officer sword when we all know it is incorrect? Let's dump the old incorrect stuff-do we refuse to learn or change? Must we keep saying the same old outdated crap? 200 Himmler daggers? Postman's dagger? Funeral dagger? Death Camp SS skull & bones dagger?

Houston, add to the list Glider Pilot's Dagger for the DLV/NSFK Knife and Staff Leader for the NPEA with grip eagle in the bayonet type scabbard.
Ron Weinand
Weinand Militaria

Hello, I am still living in the past and have missed out something for sure, if they are not officer candidate swords then what are they now?
sorry if it sounds dumb
Thanks for reading,
Martin

These Officer degens without grip emblems are clearly SS Officer degens. There is a difference of opinion as to why they were worn but as you can see they were clearly worn by Officers.
Also--these etched degen blades go back to the 60's. Our old buddy Atwood had piles of them on his table at shows.

another

Thank you so much for the info, very interesting! Am I correct, these swords come
with grip wire and without?
I wonder why these officers would choose to wear a non badged sword?

Thanks so much

Martin

An interesting question, apparently without a definitive answer. Some speculate, the "no runes" grip was worn by SS officers who were not awarded the "honor degen," with runes. Others believe they had a special purpose and may have been worn by special units such as the SD, whose right collar tabs carry no runes. It would appear the "no runes" grips with wire tend to be of earlier production. The lack of wire may have been a later expedient, or the wire may have been deleted to further set apart that degen from the honor degen. Some think the "wireless" degens were postwar produced from leftover parts. I know of no reliable, credible information that sheds definitive information on the subject. As Houston's photos demonstrate, there is no doubt, for whatever reason, the "runeless" degens were worn by some SS officers. Another mystery of the hobby.

Have anyone seen/owned a "runeless" degen with solid nickel fittings?

And yet another question :
Could someone post a pic or 2 of the first mentioned post-war etched blade? Would be so nice to have a reference!

Cheers,

Anybody have any photos of the Atwood blades?
thanks,
DTS

I am not very kosher with all these blades that I have seen frequenlty over the last years mostly to find on these false called SS candidate Degen.

Can you explain what proof there is that the runeless degen are not a ss officer canidate degen as it was thought to be for so many years?
The great photo's that Houston kindly posted shows low ranking officers with these degens but why could'nt they have received them when they were canidates and still carried them until chosen to receive the honor degen.
What new recent info has become avalible to disprove that it's not a canidates degen as now thought to be true?
Thanks.

Hello Houston,
my english is not the best,but i am correct with your quote :... the etched degen blades go back to the 60`s.Our old buddy Atwood ... !
You mean all etched officer candidates blades are Atwood fakes ?!-ok combustible are the "Müller-blades" and wh